'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

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'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby 162 105 375 845 281 » Sun Aug 21, 2011 3:25 am

So, a lot of things have been coming to light that we THOUGHT we knew, and are discovering we have been horribly wrong the whole time.

Two amazing lifeforms we previously discarded, are now suddenly REALLY interesting in various circles.

1) The Jelly - are you jelly? Jelly FISH? Previously, we looked at these things and some of us decided they were more of a kind of plant-animal hybrid... given that their babies fuse to the ocean floor or solids and form 'polyps', that seems somewhat plantlike-animal-like-ish. The polyps have actually been observed to clone themselves and 'walk' around leaving their old clone behind and stepping into a new clone. At some point, the polyps have formed several structures that they begin to disconnect from and send floating off into the sea to be baby jellyfish... stage 2.

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Now previously, we looked at the jellyfish and saw something mindless, clear, without choice or perception, just a floating jelly blob with a stomach and tentacles that reacts to whatever it bumps into or catches. We dismissed this little guy. What you see above, is in fact, A BOX JELLYFISH EYEBALL! It turns out these guys have incredibly advanced eyes HOLY CRAP and they have a lot of them. These guys can see MORE than just 360 degrees (think about it carefully, we consider vision to be planar, jellys do not have the same planar 360 degree vision goal or model... they see more than our idea of '360 degree vision').

Turns out, BOX JELLY DONT HAVE A BRAIN BUT THEY ARE AWARE! They actually have now been looked at more thoroughly and we see they have a neural structure but actually the box jelly appears to have 4 neural clusters. The box jelly HUNTS ITS PREY (why else do you need eyes hehe), it can discern colors, and it can practice active foraging techniques. It seems to be capable of memory as it often seems to gravitate towards where its food hides and avoid obstacles.

Further investigation shows that the most nasty jellyfish poisons, are INCREDIBLY nasty. Where most venoms from most creatures are either destructive to the flesh (brown recluse spider and many other crawlies), destructive to the circulatory system (damage of red blood cells damage of blood vessles direct attack on heart etc this is some snake venoms), OR destructive to the nervous system (paralysis type effects like a scorpion). Mother Nature seems to dictate every venomous species can only pick ONE. Jellyfish have ALL other forms of venom we see in the animal kingdom, and some of them have it all-in-one. There is no c-c-c-c-c-combo breaker, and actually its currently said that we have little hope of ever creating an anti-venom because its so destructive and current anti-venom methods will have no way to address all the ways it attacks and definitely not all at the same time.

Last amazing jellyfish fact, apparently we have a jellyfish that appears to have true-biological immortality.

ht tp://en dot wikipedia dot org/wiki/Turritopsis_nutricula - this jelly has the ability to return to polyp form. Technically polyps are not considered jellyfish but a part of the jellyfish cycle, the lil guys that separate FROM them are the jellys. Well no more, because a jelly that can revert to polyp stage is a jelly at polyp stage, and it is hence able to achieve biological immortality by becoming a polyp again. Polyps are thought to 'live' for as long as they are not destroyed, and it seems they are thriving lately.

That appears to be the only reason why we have 'rediscovered' the jellyfish, it is exploding in numbers in our oceans and we are realizing just how ignorant it was to throw the jelly back in the ocean and assume what it does and doesn't do because we couldn't find a brain in it.

2) Plants. It seems so far fetched now, to assume what we knew of plants is all that there was to know. Fortunately for them and us, we are finding out they are far more respectable than what we ever knew. Plants are showing us, once again, our own ignorance when we studied them and once again, dubbed them 'brainless' so assumed all the things they cannot do because they do not have 'a brain'.

Some of those horror movies with plants coming alive, are actually not too far from the truth. Plants are showing us that many of them have the ability to communicate not just with each other, but with opposing species, related species, and even communicate across long distances.

ht tp://www dot livescience dot com/1909-plants-communicate-warn-danger.html

There are even very subtle but very incredible reactions that plants have that would totally blow all your science teachers you had as a kid out of the water. No brain? Well its we who were incapable of thinking. It is now being acknowledged that new field of plant study will be examining plants for their abilities that, for all intents and purposes, are also signs of 'intelligence'. Get a load of this article...

Plant neurobiology: an integrated view of plant signaling.
Brenner ED, Stahlberg R, Mancuso S, Vivanco J, Baluska F, Van Volkenburgh E.
Source

Genomics, New York Botanical Garden, NY 10458, USA. ebrenner at nybg dot org (do not email from here please email from their page or a page that displays this email addey, basically you didn't get it from me :)

Abstract

Plant neurobiology is a newly focused field of plant biology research that aims to understand how plants process the information they obtain from their environment to develop, prosper and reproduce optimally. The behavior plants exhibit is coordinated across the whole organism by some form of integrated signaling, communication and response system. This system includes long-distance electrical signals, vesicle-mediated transport of auxin in specialized vascular tissues, and production of chemicals known to be neuronal in animals. Here we review how plant neurobiology is being directed toward discovering the mechanisms of signaling in whole plants, as well as among plants and their neighbors.


ht tp://www dot ncbi dot nlm dot nih dot gov/pubmed/16843034

Isn't that just freaking amazing. Its very clear, we do not have a firm grasp at ALL on how plants are communicating within themselves and with each other. Darwin's 'root brain' theory is once again making a comeback.

Intelligent Plants? Well yes lets consider, what is intelligence? The ability to be aware of ones surroundings and react or act to influence it? Plants actively conquer and steal energy and life from other plants (such as a vine), and some plants actively produce systems to lure insects or edible animals in close enough to 'eat' them. Plants actively communicate, they even face the sun in the morning before the sun starts to rise - they exhibit 'memory'. Memory is a function of learning, and plants 'remember' the sun very well, you can continually and randomly rotate a plant, and it will continually reorient on the sun. We know that we know quite a lot when we take a core sample out of a tree. Theres absolutely NOTHING to suggest that the tree itself doesn't know what we are drilling into it to learn - technically it has recorded the information we get from it.

In fact, there is evidence that plants are able to plan their root systems and growth patterns and they typically plan growth patterns by looking two years back. I wish I had a link for that study, that sounds incredible, but then again so does the suggestion made that a tree has the ability to 'call 911'. I am not allowed to reference the work and you may have to find some similar stuff, but apparently a tree was observed, threatened by imminent danger or sensing possible death, to change the PH in its soil very rapidly which released unusual amounts of hydrogen ions into the air and gave the tree a slight electrical charge.

What it does with the electrical charge it picks up and the ions that float into the air, is anyone's guess right now, but its becoming obvious that our ignorance on the 'brain' issue has once again turned to bite us in the ass and remind us to stop thinking we know everything, that the brainless actually know plenty of things we don't.

The brainless are showing us they are in fact aware, they are present, and they have some unique ways of doing what we assumed they were not possible of doing, and they do it in ways that change what we thought we knew.

I'd say it was unbelievable myself, but the very fact that so many are quick to say so without combing for evidence, makes me hold my tongue and do just that. Quite frankly I'm impressed at what I've found. I wonder if my basil knows I love it?

Edit: I actually have a lot of basil lol. Thinking back, I noticed that the basil behaves in an unusual way that live on the top-floor of a 4 story planter-tower setup. The ones on the top almost look like a different species, their leaves are more angular than rounded, kind of diamond-shaped, and the leaves that get the most sun actually fold into a V shape when they face the sun, so they can control the amount of light the leaf receives as it appears the summer sun is a little rough. I will move them tomorrow ^___^
Why do I screw up my links? Because my posts have been deleted on various news and medical sites and because if I link it here and you click it here, it means you heard it through here but if you put it into your browser, the website gets a hit.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby chaosscizzors » Sun Aug 21, 2011 11:05 pm

interesting stuff. next thing you know we're going to find out that planets can actively communicate information to each other lol.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby Arcturus » Mon Aug 22, 2011 12:38 pm

chaosscizzors wrote:interesting stuff. next thing you know we're going to find out that planets can actively communicate information to each other lol.


I can just imagine how the Earth would feel, all sad and alone. Venus would be cruel and bitter, and Pluto would be the socially awkward one that doesn't quite fit.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby ex nihilo » Mon Aug 22, 2011 7:21 pm

Great, now I feel more guilty about eating plants... :(
"Pah! It's only as complicated as you choose to make it! Was the old woman happy? Unhappy? Who can say? One can never know for true, you simply make your best attempt and move on..." -Grimorie Weiss, refering to doing right and making happy.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby Vincent » Tue Aug 23, 2011 12:04 am

ex nihilo wrote:Great, now I feel more guilty about eating plants... :(


Trust me, you wouldn't mind eating a computer if it was made of plants. They have specialized functions that have been brought up due to their adaptation to the environment, and I'm not only talking about climate, but also fauna and flora. But that doesn't mean they have feeling and a sentience that's anywhere close to ours.

But yes indeed 162, we keep rediscovering daily things. Banalization is a crime against science, it's the murder of interest. We can learn and discover so much things just by staring at something that looks so simple, a bowl of cereal for instance. In order to learn you must accept that you have to learn, rather than being convinced that you know everything. But I wouldn't say we're stupid, 162. We're simply ignorants.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby 162 105 375 845 281 » Tue Aug 23, 2011 8:08 am

ex nihilo wrote:Great, now I feel more guilty about eating plants... :(


haha, I don't feel too bad because I grow them. I grilled a pineapple at a cookout and its doing really well right now after I brought the top back to health. Anyways, many plants have designed themselves to be eaten, so don't feel too bad. Radishes grow like a mother, they're obviously edible but they grow fast enough to keep up with the few people who love radishes. Anything that wants you to eat it probably has seeds in what you are eating, so you can feel good about that!

Vincent wrote:
We're simply ignorants.



I dunno, I mean... what is the lowest existence estimate per religion, 5000 years? 5000 years for plants isn't as long for us though I suppose, but its an awful long time to miss out on something we see all around us every day.

I think we really aren't that stupid, however our ignorance MAKES us more stupid as we try to yell louder our own opinion over somebody who is trying to educate us. And oh I dunno lets say somebody throws out an insult the plant argument by saying 'computers can respond to stimuli and measure their surroundings DOES THAT MAKE THEM ALIVE TOO? LOL U NUB'

Effin... education wasn't if a plant was ALIVE it was if it displayed base level of intelligence and could communicate and had a neural network that functions as a 'brain' but isn't a central nervous system. I see a lot of this behavior, it goes > person sees title of subject article or whatever > person formulates opinion > person may or may not read material > person will have already made up their mind by now anyways > person directly opposes the idea of the article/subject/whatever by assuming that they know what they know therefore it is true.


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People still like to point to their IQ as a source of credibility these days. Truth is nobody gives a sh!t if you have a 160 IQ, if you aren't being treated special for it and have a special place in school or society for being so damn smart, then I guess that means nobody cares right? LOL

'Smart' and 'Intelligent' mean very little today. A pretty young lady told me she thought I was interesting because I am intelligent. Story ends. The 'smart' people are not all in good jobs benefiting society, thats a lie we teach our kids in the states. Your boss wont ask for your IQ before he hires you, theres no spot for it on the application, and most people sound like pompous assholes when they talk about IQ because they are looking for somebody to impress. You can't prove your IQ over the internet either. Nobody is going to be able to verify it.

Ignorance is so abundant that I really think and believe that knowledge is the new 'smart' and 'intelligent'. But I have a view that is somewhat biased ^_^ edit : I am thinking about it and knowledge is a really good medium and mantra for the internet.
Why do I screw up my links? Because my posts have been deleted on various news and medical sites and because if I link it here and you click it here, it means you heard it through here but if you put it into your browser, the website gets a hit.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby rrazputin » Sun Aug 28, 2011 2:11 am

Considering that jellyfish are rapidly multiplying due to warming ocean temperatures, this could mean they are the next chosen dominant species of Earth. I for one welcome our new jelly overlords.
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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby Nathan Sanders » Sun Aug 28, 2011 12:52 pm

All Hail The Hypnotoad!

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Re: 'Brainless' things remind us how stupid WE are.

Postby 162 105 375 845 281 » Sun Aug 28, 2011 11:49 pm

rrazputin wrote:Considering that jellyfish are rapidly multiplying due to warming ocean temperatures, this could mean they are the next chosen dominant species of Earth. I for one welcome our new jelly overlords.


All hail the jelly invasion! They have figured out immortality and that we can't eat their super deadly poison and they moved their staging area to a place we can't reach lol.

Plant neurobiology might be used as a counter-argument for vegetarianism as it would promote real interest and possibly forge a new diet plan based on what plants willingly and do not willingly provide as food. XD
Why do I screw up my links? Because my posts have been deleted on various news and medical sites and because if I link it here and you click it here, it means you heard it through here but if you put it into your browser, the website gets a hit.
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